Jump to content

Does the Mainstream Virus exist in Black Metal???


LiakosVikernes666

Recommended Posts

Re: Does the Mainstream Virus exist in Black Metal??? Cradle of Filth got popular because of their crossover appeal to the goth crowd initially, and have more recently had crossover appeal with the Hot Topic crowd as well. They also have progressively dropped their extreme metal elements in favor of more melodic/gothic elements, which makes their newer stuff easier to listen to for the masses than The Principle of Evil Made Flesh.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Re: Does the Mainstream Virus exist in Black Metal??? What I was saying is that they have become more mainstream over time, but that because of the gothic influences they have had from the beginning, they have always appealed to a wider market than just the narrow black/death metal market. Becoming less extreme over time is hardly an anomaly for any metal band, a certain degree of "mellowing out" can almost always be expected, and while this has most definitely helped them to draw in more fans, I don't think I would call it a simple ploy to make more money and become "mainstream".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Re: Does the Mainstream Virus exist in Black Metal???

I'm only aware of Deicide getting heavier over time' date=' but they are a death metal band, so this is kinda off topic :P[/quote'] Legion was maybe heavier than the debut, but that's about where it stops with them. They became a lot less vicious and heavy after Legion, and have been getting pretty melodic recently.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 5 months later...

Within metal circles, Black Metal has become pretty mainstream - particularly the symphonic stuff (such as the aforementioned Cradle of Filth and Dimmu Borgir). However, outside of metal, I don't think it's very mainstream. So I'm not too concerned - I'm pretty sure that Top Shop and the like will not be stocking Dimmu Borgir t-shirts in the near future. Additionally, whether or not a band (or genre) is classed as 'mainstream' is irrelevant to me. I like what I like - it doesn't matter if nobody else likes it or if 50,000 people like it. I listen to music for my own enjoyment, sod everyone else :D *edit* I've just noticed this is a pretty old thread! Sorry for resurrecting old stuff!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Re: Does the Mainstream Virus exist in Black Metal??? Indeed, even the most mainstream of black metal bands are still far from being pop music. I don't like Dimmu or Cradle's black metal material (neither have really been black metal for a while) as much as stuff like Abigor or Lunar Aurora, but I still enjoy them. Sent from my HTC PH39100 using Tapatalk 2

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To a certain extent' date=' yes. But honestly, I think black metal's biggest problem is actually trying to stay too underground and inaccessible; bands deliberately recording their music in the cheapest manner possible to sound kult, with the result being their albums sounding like a wall of shit.[/quote'] This is true with many of the "bedroom black metal" stereotype bands, but just as many black metal bands have a thick and full production. Even early on, it was mostly just Scandinavian black metal that emphasized this approach, and even then bands like Marduk, Arckanum, and Dissection eschewed that production technique in favor of more warm and clear production. The truth is that most of it started for lack of having a budget to make it sound better, but the technique stuck for many bands that worshiped the old Norwegian and French sounds, but you can hear plenty of black metal from the same time with much better production, like in the Czech, Italian, and Greek scenes.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the use of shit production for the sake of it is a bit rubbish. However, I do also feel that there is a time and a place for the harsher sound. Sammath recently released a demo track from their forthcoming album and I think the low-fi production gives it a really raw and uncompromising atmosphere. I think the track is going to be tidied up somewhat before its actual release, so it'll be interesting to compare the two versions when the album becomes available. Just in case you're interested, here's the track I was talking about: rlszQkcCuqY

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sure, it does lend itself well to some albums, but it's also a stereotype that doesn't exist for everything. I get sick of hearing about how black metal is "always so under-produced" and "intentionally sounds like mud", but this is nowhere near always the case, and when it is it's often because it's a demo or debut album. It's not cheap to make an album, so I can understand the feeling of just wanting to get it out there and save some money, but many black metal bands do go for a bigger production that does work for them in most cases.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Sure' date=' it does lend itself well to some albums, but it's also a stereotype that doesn't exist for everything. I get sick of hearing about how black metal is "always so under-produced" and "intentionally sounds like mud", but this is nowhere near always the case, and when it is it's often because it's a demo or debut album. It's not cheap to make an album, so I can understand the feeling of just wanting to get it out there and save some money, but many black metal bands do go for a bigger production that does work for them in most cases.[/quote'] I agree with you - there's a place for both. :D
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some bands deserve their success after toiling and releasing quality albums in the underground, Behexen, Inquisition, and Watain (yeah, they're shit) but all of these bands have paid their dues and have persevered relentlessly to get where they are. Defining "mainstream" success on the level of Cradle of filth is one thing, but when I see these bands getting shit like Inquisition for playing 70,000 tons of metal its kind of aggravating. It's like fucking hell guys how many years do you expect exceptionally talented musicians, to limited their albums to 500 7' hand numbered copies of black vinyl that and constantly playing smaller regional fests- until you finally realize some bands have worked their way to where they are. I love underground black and death like most other guys, but if a band plays well and earns their success who cares who they play with ESPECIALLY when they keep their original sound.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some bands deserve their success after toiling and releasing quality albums in the underground, Behexen, Inquisition, and Watain (yeah, they're shit) but all of these bands have paid their dues and have persevered relentlessly to get where they are. Defining "mainstream" success on the level of Cradle of filth is one thing, but when I see these bands getting shit like Inquisition for playing 70,000 tons of metal its kind of aggravating. It's like fucking hell guys how many years do you expect exceptionally talented musicians, to limited their albums to 500 7' hand numbered copies of black vinyl that and constantly playing smaller regional fests- until you finally realize some bands have worked their way to where they are. I love underground black and death like most other guys, but if a band plays well and earns their success who cares who they play with ESPECIALLY when they keep their original sound.
I agree completely. Well, aside from the Watain comment - haha! If a band works hard and remains true to their sound, then I'm happy for them to achieve some sort of commercial success.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Join Metal Forum

    joinus-home.jpg

  • Our picks

    • Whichever tier of thrash metal you consigned Sacred Reich back in the 80's/90's they still had their moments.  "Ignorance" & "Surf Nicaragura" did a great job of establishing the band, whereas "The American Way" just got a little to comfortable and accessible (the title track grates nowadays) for my ears.  A couple more records better left forgotten about and then nothing for twenty three years.  2019 alone has now seen three releases from Phil Rind and co.  A live EP, a split EP with Iron Reagan and now a full length.

      Notable addition to the ranks for the current throng of releases is former Machine Head sticksman, Dave McClean.  Love or hate Machine Head, McClean is a more than capable drummer and his presence here is felt from the off with the opening and title track kicking things off with some real gusto.  'Divide & Conquer' and 'Salvation' muddle along nicely, never quite reaching any quality that would make my balls tingle but comfortable enough.  The looming build to 'Manifest Reality' delivers a real punch when the song starts proper.  Frenzied riffs and drums with shots of lead work to hold the interest.


      There's a problem already though (I know, I am such a fucking mood hoover).  I don't like Phil's vocals.  I never had if I am being honest.  The aggression to them seems a little forced even when they are at their best on tracks like 'Manifest Reality'.  When he tries to sing it just feels weak though ('Salvation') and tracks lose real punch.  Give him a riffy number such as 'Killing Machine' and he is fine with the Reich engine (probably a poor choice of phrase) up in sixth gear.  For every thrashy riff there's a fair share of rock edged, local bar act rhythm aplenty too.

      Let's not poo-poo proceedings though, because overall I actually enjoy "Awakening".  It is stacked full of catchy riffs that are sticky on the old ears.  Whilst not as raw as perhaps the - brilliant - artwork suggests with its black and white, tattoo flash sheet style design it is enjoyable enough.  Yes, 'Death Valley' & 'Something to Believe' have no place here, saved only by Arnett and Radziwill's lead work but 'Revolution' is a fucking 80's thrash heyday throwback to the extent that if you turn the TV on during it you might catch a new episode of Cheers!

      3/5
      • Reputation Points

      • 10 replies
    • I
      • Reputation Points

      • 2 replies
    • https://www.metalforum.com/blogs/entry/52-vltimas-something-wicked-marches-in/
      • Reputation Points

      • 3 replies

    • https://www.metalforum.com/blogs/entry/48-candlemass-the-door-to-doom/
      • Reputation Points

      • 2 replies
    • Full length number 19 from overkill certainly makes a splash in the energy stakes, I mean there's some modern thrash bands that are a good two decades younger than Overkill who can only hope to achieve the levels of spunk that New Jersey's finest produce here.  That in itself is an achievement, for a band of Overkill's stature and reputation to be able to still sound relevant four decades into their career is no mean feat.  Even in the albums weaker moments it never gets redundant and the energy levels remain high.  There's a real sense of a band in a state of some renewed vigour, helped in no small part by the addition of Jason Bittner on drums.  The former Flotsam & Jetsam skinsman is nothing short of superb throughout "The Wings of War" and seems to have squeezed a little extra out of the rest of his peers.

      The album kicks of with a great build to opening track "Last Man Standing" and for the first 4 tracks of the album the Overkill crew stomp, bash and groove their way to a solid level of consistency.  The lead work is of particular note and Blitz sounds as sneery and scathing as ever.  The album is well produced and mixed too with all parts of the thrash machine audible as the five piece hammer away at your skull with the usual blend of chugging riffs and infectious anthems.  


      There are weak moments as mentioned but they are more a victim of how good the strong tracks are.  In it's own right "Distortion" is a solid enough - if not slightly varied a journey from the last offering - but it just doesn't stand up well against a "Bat Shit Crazy" or a "Head of a Pin".  As the album draws to a close you get the increasing impression that the last few tracks are rescued really by some great solos and stomping skin work which is a shame because trimming of a couple of tracks may have made this less obvious. 

      4/5
      • Reputation Points

      • 4 replies
×
×
  • Create New...